1 IN THE CIRCUIT COURT OF THE SIXTH JUDICIAL CIRCUIT IN AND FOR 2 PINELLAS COUNTY, FLORIDA 3 CASE NO. 00-002750-CI-20 4 5 CHURCH OF SCIENTOLOGY FLAG SERVICE ORGANIZATION, INC., 6 Plaintiff, 7 VS. 8 DELL LIEBREICH, Individually and 9 as Personal Representative of the Estate of Lisa McPherson and 10 KENNAN G. DANDAR, 11 Defendants. 12 13 BEFORE: HONORABLE W. DOUGLAS BAIRD 14 PLACE: Pinellas County Courthouse 315 Court Street North 15 Clear water, Florida 16 DATE: August 23, 2001 17 TIME: 1:00 - 1:30 p.m. 18 REPORTED BY: TONYA H. MAGEE, RPR Court Reporter and Notary Public 19 State of Florida at Large 20 21 HEARING 22 Pages 1 - 14 23 ROBERT A. DEMPSTER & ASSOCIATES 24 COURT REPORTERS P.O. BOX 35 25 CLEARWATER, FLORIDA 34618-0035 (727) 443-0992 2 1 A P P E A R A N C E S: 2 3 F. WALLACE POPE, JR., ESQUIRE Johnson, Blakely, Pope, 4 Bokor, Ruppel & Burns, P.A. Post Office Box 1388 5 Clearwater, Florida 33757 6 SAMUEL D. ROSEN, ESQUIRE (Appearing telephonically) 7 Paul, Hastings, Jonfsky & Walker, P.A. 75 East 55th Street 8 New York City, New York 10022 9 Attorneys for the Plaintiff. 10 JOHN MERRETT, ESQUIRE 11 11250 St. Augustine Road Suite 15-393 12 Jacksonville, Florida 32257-1147 13 Attorney for Robert Minton. 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 6 3 1 P R 0 C E E D I N G S 2 THE COURT: All right. We are waiting a call 3 from Mr. Rosen. Okay. Afternoon. 4 MR. ROSEN: Good afternoon, Your Honor. 5 THE COURT: Okay. We are here regarding an 6 order to show cause why Robert Minton should not be 7 held in contempt for his failure to appear for 8 deposition on August 3rd. Will you be arguing 9 that? 10 MR. POPE: I will be arguing that, Your Honor. 11 May I? 12 THE COURT: Please. 13 MR. POPE: May it please the Court. We are 14 here today really on a procedural motion, and that 15 is why you should issue an order for failure to 16 show cause as to why Mr. Minton should not be held 17 in contempt for failure to participate in a 18 deposition that he was ordered to do so on 19 August 3, 2001. 20 Let me just briefly set the stage here with 21 where we are in our efforts to have Mr. Minton's 22 deposition taken. We have been trying, fairly 23 earnestly, since February of this year, the last 24 seven months, to take Mr. Minton's deposition in. 25 this case. We issued our first two subpoenas that 1 are parleying this thing. We issued our first 2 subpoena on February 9, setting him for deposition 3 on March 1. Mr. Minton moved to quash that 4 subpoena and to sanction me. The Court denied that 5 motion on February 28, leaving the March 1 date 6 valid. 7 On March the 5th, the Court entered an order 8 granting our motion to compel the deposition. On 9 March the 6th, Mr. Minton filed on appeal the order 10 denying the motion to quash. On June the 6th, we 11 moved to dismiss the appeal as moot because, in the 12 meantime, we served a second subpoena as to which 13 that objection did not apply. On June 14, this 14 Court basically found Mr. Minton in contempt 15 regarding subpoena number one, ordered him to 16 appear, no later than 30 days from the order, to 17 comply with the subpoena. 18 On June the 28, the appellate court ordered 19 Mr. Minton to respond to the motion to dismiss it 20 as moot within 15 days. He never has responded, 21 but the court is in recess and nothing has happened 22 with respect to that particular motion. On July 23 11, the appellate court granted Mr. Minton's 24 emergency motion to stay your June 14 contempt 25 order regarding subpoena number one. That's where 5 1 things stand right now. 2 Subpoena number two was issued May 22 of this 3 year. We served him with that second subpoena on 4 May the 24th. He moved to quash or modify, but not 5 for the same reason as with subpoena number one. 6 June 6, this Court ordered Mr. Minton to appear for 7 deposition by June 29. No deposition of Mr. Minton 8 occurred June 29. 9 On July 25, with regard to this subpoena, this 10 second subpoena, the Court found in effect 11 Mr. Minton in contempt and ordered Mr. Minton's 12 deposition to proceed on August 3 at 9:30 a.m. On 13 August the 3rd, Mr. Minton fails to appear. No 14 notice is given to counsel. Mr. Rosen flies down. 15 There is a certificate on file with the Court of 16 non-appearance. And these are the reasons that 17 Mr. Merrett advanced for his non-appearance: 18 "Mr. Minton was prepared to come even to the point 19 of having airline reservations. At some point, 20 apparently yesterday, he became aware that 21 Scientology obtained and posted on the internet 22 fairly detailed information about a mental health 23 professional that treated not only him, but his 24 wife in the past. As a result of that, his mental 25 therapist has informed me that it is not possible 1 for him to give a deposition at this point because 2 the likelihood is that it would have a disastrous 3 affect on his mental health and will result in 4 immediate hospitalization. We need to reschedule 5 this. Had the posting been made earlier in the 6 week, then we would have known in advance, but we 7 did not know he was not going to be here until 8 really late last night. We were trying to book him 9 on a flight, but in any event that's why he is not 10 here." 11 Mr. Merrett didn't reveal who this therapist 12 is, and to this day we don't know who this 13 therapist is. We filed a motion to show cause in 14 the court and set this matter for hearing. 15 Mr. Minton has filed -- and I got it right about 16 noontime today. I was served with a stack of 17 papers, which is a broadside attack on Scientology 18 for various matters that occurred 30 years ago and 19 in between then and now. Seems to me that, you 20 know, it's sort of -- if you remember Flip Wilson 21 and his character Geraldine, it's 22 the-Devil-made-me-do-it defense, because the great 23 monster here sabotaged me and it's impaired my 24 mental health. 25 This is not the time to decide the merits. 1 The issue is should the Court put him to his proof 2 as to why he didn't appear. So we would ask the 3 Court for an order to show cause. 4 MR. MERRETT: Your Honor, in brief response, a 5 couple corrections with respect to the time line as 6 proposed by Mr. Pope The March 1 date on the 7 original subpoena actually had been cancelled 8 between the parties well before the March - 9 THE COURT: Well, I'm not sure that subpoena 10 number one is really at issue here at this point. 11 MR. MERRETT: With respect to subpoena number, 12 two, the deposition was ordered for by the Court, 13 and it is correct that Mr. Minton didn't appear, 14 but the Court to cite the authorities in response, 15 and I give the Court a copy of that criminal 16 contempt, adheres exclusively to activities 17 deliberately undertaken to dissipate the order of 18 the Court. 19 What I have done is not attempting to sabotage 20 the Court or anybody else, and I will be blunt, a 21 great deal of time would be wasted on the 22 declarations regarding an order to show cause. We 23 have laid out for you what happened. We have 24 Mr. Minton's affidavit. We have Miss Brook's 25 affidavit. We have the outrageous posting that was 8 1 put on the internet. We have flyers that were put 2 on Mr. Minton's daughter's doorstep. All of this 3 happened on the day before he was supposed to come 4 to the deposition. 5 We've also got detailed in the affidavit that 6 the last time he was set for deposition in the 7 death case, somebody jumped on him and sent him to 8 the hospital the Saturday before he was supposed to 9 appear for the deposition, with the same results. 10 Additionally, you have detailed that it's 11 Scientology's principle of making criminals -- of 12 seeking criminal convictions of anybody who opposes 13 them. And what you have here, you are looking at 14 the timing of the flyers, the timing of the posting 15 on the internet and where they were directed at 16 Mr. Minton and his family, his wife and kids who 17 have nothing to do with this. It is obvious that 18 the purpose was to induce this situation. 19 What I would suggest to you with regard to 20 taking the deposition are one, two, three, four - 21 six dates, and four of them are much more 22 convenient to Mr. Rosen. The week of September 10 23 in Boston, two dates the week of -- well, the 17 24 and 19 of September. And assuming that Scientology 25 is able to refrain from other personal attacks on 1 Mr. Minton's family between now and then, there 2 shouldn't be any problem. 3 Given the clear unequivocal and uncontroverted 4 behavior of Scientology, which could only be aimed S at producing the state of mind, a state of outrage 6 and distress that would make it impossible to 7 appear, else that, there is no reason we will not 8 proceed. He had airline reservations and they were 9 repeatedly changed. They kept going up in 10 anticipation that he was going to be able to come 11 down and come here for deposition. But with this 12 attack being one of many, many attacks, it simply 13 wasn't possible. 14 In other words, Judge, I don't think that 15 either the Court or the parties or counsel, given 16 availability of these alternate dates, most of 17 which have the greater advantage to the attorney 18 who's been hired by Scientology, the lead attorney, 19 Mr. Rosen, I don't think that looking at everything 20 that you have in front of you on a prima facie 21 basis, the reason to show cause, I don't think that 22 looking at it from a wider perspective that the 23 reason -- given the reason for Mr. Minton's 24 non-appearance is clearly not, what one judge in 25 Jacksonville described, contempt. You can do it 10 1 however you want to, but it does not amount to 2 thumbing your nose at the Court. That's more a 3 precise legal description of what we have. 4 As I say, we have these dates. Some of them 5 are calculated specifically for the convenience to 6 Mr. Rosen. I don't think that based on a prima 7 facie case, Mr. Minton is -thumbing his nose at this 8 Court, but rather that Scientology is succeeding in 9 another attempt. However, if they stick with the 10 questions that have to do with the subject matter 12 of this case, it will be about a 45 minute 12 deposition. 13 MR. ROSEN: Your Honor, this is Mr. Rosen. 14 May I be heard from? 15 THE COURT: Are you done? 16 MR. MERRETT: I think both of these lawyers 17 represent the same parties. 18 THE COURT: He asked if he could be heard. Do 19 you have an objection to him being heard? 20 MR. MERRETT: I'm just curious as to why 21 Scientology is - 22 THE COURT: You mentioned some things about 23 Mr. Rosen. He may have something to say about 24 that. What is it, Mr. Rosen? 25 MR. ROSEN: Your Honor, just a couple points 11 1 to respond to what Mr. Merrett said. First of all 2 there is no uncontroverted evidence of what 3 Mr. Merrett presents. Scientology never posted 4 anything with respect to Mr. Minton's mental health 5 or anything else. The proposition that they did is 6 something that is not only controverted, but it is 7 to which there is no evidence. 8 Mr. Merrett says this is no big deal, we'll 9 just reschedule the deposition. I got a letter 10 from him offering to schedule the deposition on 11 four different dates in Boston. This may be 12 dejavous all over again, but he originally asked 13 you, Your Honor, to require that the deposition be 14 in Boston on the grounds that Mr. Minton 15 infrequently comes to the state of Florida. You 16 denied that. 17 The second request was, well, Judge, at least 18 make them pay for Mr. Minton to come to Florida, 19 and you denied that one twice. And now Mr. Minton - 20. has taken to writing me a letter proposing dates in 21 Boston. That's just unacceptable. We are just 22 rearguing an issue that has previously been 23 decided. And the last point I have is this: In my 24 mind there is no possibility that if we reschedule . 25 this deposition, it would occur, and the reason I 1 say that is not only because of the history before 2 you, but we have a trial history with Mr. Merrett 3 in the federal court in Tampa in which he 4 represents the Lisa McPherson Trust, and we know 5 the modus operandi. What happens is the notice of 6 contempt, then failure to appear for the deposition 7 to the DCA of the 11th Circuit in the Tampa case 8 seeking a stay in the deposition. If the stay is 9 denied, you have to go to deposition. The stay was 10 denied. 11 And I will tell you one deposition that 12 Mr. Merrett did. He walked into the deposition 13 with a federal court order. He went into the 14 deposition with his lawyer and said, we have 15 complied. The order said says we have to appear. 16 The order doesn't say we have to answer questions. 17 It says we have to appear. There is actually a 18 motion for contempt pending against him before 19 Judge Lusaria in Tampa. 20 This deposition is not going to happen. I 21 think I said that to you a long time ago, Your 22 Honor. I predicted that was going to be the case. 23 The history of it bears it out. I'm not interested 24 in Mr. Merrett or an affidavit as to the excuse. 25 If there is a truth to this theory about why his 13 1 client did not appear on August 3rd, let his client 2 take the stand and tell the story in front of you. 3 Give us a chance to cross-examine his client. 4 And what I ask you to do is this. Simply set 5 a date for an evidentiary hearing on contempt. If 6 you find contempt and, you disbelieve the story, as 7 I think you are going to when you hear this out of 8 the mouth of the witnesses opposed to the mouth the 9 camel. I'm going to ask you to for an evidentiary 10 hearing. That's the only way we can get this 11 deposition. 12 THE COURT: Yeah, I think it's appropriate to 13 go ahead and have an evidentiary hearing and some 14 testimony and some cross-examination. I think I 15 will consider that best. So if you want to prepare 16 an order, get some time and we will have an order 17 to show cause and Mr. Minton can appear. Okay. 18 Thank you. 19 THEREUPON, the hearing concluded at 1:30 p.m. 20 21 22 23 24 25 14 1 REPORTER'S HEARING CERTIFICATE 2 STATE OF FLORIDA ) 3 COUNTY OF PINELLAS ) 9 5 I, TONYA HORNSBY-MAGEE, Registered Professional 6 Reporter, certify that I was authorized to and did 7 stenographically report the hearing before the 8 Honorable W. Douglas Baird; and that the transcript 9 is a true and complete record of my stenographic notes. 10 11 I FURTHER CERTIFY that I am not a relative, 12 employee, attorney, or counsel of any of the parties, 13 nor relative or employee of such attorney or counsel, 14 nor financially interested in the outcome of the 15 foregoing action. 16 17 Dated this 27th day of August, 2001, at Clearwater, 18 Pinellas County, Florida. 19 20 21 22 T TONYA HORNSBY -MAGEE RPR 23 24 25 |
To Life and Death of Lisa McPherson